Merry Xmas All!

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searchengineguy
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by searchengineguy »

captain howdy wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 5:52 am
Merry Christmas to all! No matter who wins
Hey Captain, great to hear from you again! Hope you join us again in the New Year. No, no-one here is really a foe :)
“One would go mad if one took the Bible seriously; but to take it seriously one must be already mad.”
Aleister Crowley

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Moonwood the Hare
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by Moonwood the Hare »

searchengineguy wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 10:18 pm
I play doddering Australian rules these days.
For those whodon't know the minutia doddering was a meansof avaoiding Nidd, a bit like stonewalling in cricket. It's not cheating but it does make for a slower game.

Chingford, overground by the way. I'm not bitter or obsessive.

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Moonwood the Hare
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by Moonwood the Hare »

captain howdy wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 5:52 am
Merry Christmas to all! No matter who wins
And to you. Here's some winter music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-sTbvkY_l4 Iheard them sing this a few weeks ago.

captain howdy
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by captain howdy »

searchengineguy wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 6:31 am
captain howdy wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 5:52 am
Merry Christmas to all! No matter who wins
Hey Captain, great to hear from you again! Hope you join us again in the New Year. No, no-one here is really a foe :)
Hi again SEG. I’ll probably poke my nose in from time to time, thanks for the kind words. Hope all is well your way!

captain howdy
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by captain howdy »

Moonwood the Hare wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 12:06 pm
captain howdy wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 5:52 am
Merry Christmas to all! No matter who wins
And to you. Here's some winter music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-sTbvkY_l4 Iheard them sing this a few weeks ago.
Thanks, Moon. Very pretty song. Here’s a clip from the great Georg Frideric Handel, and this one’s about as seasonal as it get. From Messiah https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFBIJgkj_-g

This next one is also from Händel. While not particularly seasonal it is utterly magnificent. From Judas Maccabaeus— https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p1BedwyFKY

Hope you enjoy

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Moonwood the Hare
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by Moonwood the Hare »

captain howdy wrote:
Fri Dec 27, 2019 4:49 am
Moonwood the Hare wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 12:06 pm
captain howdy wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 5:52 am
Merry Christmas to all! No matter who wins
And to you. Here's some winter music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-sTbvkY_l4 Iheard them sing this a few weeks ago.
Thanks, Moon. Very pretty song. Here’s a clip from the great Georg Frideric Handel, and this one’s about as seasonal as it get. From Messiah https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFBIJgkj_-g

This next one is also from Händel. While not particularly seasonal it is utterly magnificent. From Judas Maccabaeus— https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p1BedwyFKY

Hope you enjoy
The tune to the second one is the same as Thine be the glory. I think my palate has been ruined because although I can see why this is good I don't tend to go back and listen to it. When you appreciate this stuff, which has these Christian themes, is it something in the structure. Andrew Rilstone had something intetesting about this and Richard Dawkins liking for Christian music. I've dug it and will quote it because I think there is something quite clever about the reasoning here:
When he was on Desert Island Discs, Dawkins selected an excerpt from Bach's St Matthew Passion as one of his favourite records. He pretends not to understand why normal people thought this was a bit odd.
The interviewer asked me how I could choose religious music without being religious. You might as well say, how can you enjoy Wuthering Heights when you know perfectly well that Cathy and Heathcliff never really existed.
This is another blustering non sequitur. Emily Bronte believed that Heathcliff was a fictional character and presented her book as a work of fiction. Bach believed Jesus was a real person, and presented his Passion as a retelling of and meditation on events that he thought really happened. Bronte wrote a story which she hoped would surprise and excite and delight her readers; Bach composed a piece of music which he hoped would bring his listeners closer to God. The question of whether a work is presented as fiction or non-fiction as a profound effect on the way we read it. Would Robinson Crusoe be the same book it were discovered to be the real diary of a real castaway? Would you even bother to read The Diary of Anne Frank if it turned out to be a work of fiction? No, the fact that Bach believed Jesus to be a real person doesn't mean that his music can only be enjoyed by people who think the same. There would be nothing at all surprising about someone saying 'The story of Jesus dying and rising again is a beautiful story and I love to listen to it, but unlike Bach, I don't think that it is really true.' People say things of the same kind every day. I myself don't believe Time was incarnate in a person called Krishna but I might put the Indian language Maharbarata on the short list of Greatest TV Shows Not Featuring a Police Box. But Dawkins doesn't think that the story of the passion of the Christ is a beautiful story. He thinks it is 'sadomasochistic', 'barking mad', 'viciously unpleasant', 'tortuously nasty' and incidentally, that the people who disseminate it are worse than child molesters. What is going on when someone says that a musical celebration of a perverted, insane, vicious, unpleasant, nasty story is the one of eight things he couldn't manage without on a desert island? Dawkins pretends that he thinks that Sue Lawley thinks that it's odd that someone who doesn't believe in Jesus would want to listen to songs about Jesus. I'm sure she doesn't think anything nearly so silly. What she probably thinks is odd is that someone who finds a particular story horrible should want to listen to it over and over again. It's a bit like a noted black man who's campaigned all his life for racial equality saying that Birth of a Nation is his favourite movie. It's possible, of course: maybe he admires the camera work, or finds that it helps him understand how racists think. But he wouldn't come over all wounded if Ms. Lawley asked him why.
http://www.andrewrilstone.com/2007/05/w ... p-for.html

captain howdy
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by captain howdy »

Moonwood the Hare wrote:
Sun Dec 29, 2019 10:25 pm
captain howdy wrote:
Fri Dec 27, 2019 4:49 am
[Thanks, Moon. Very pretty song. Here’s a clip from the great Georg Frideric Handel, and this one’s about as seasonal as it get. From Messiah https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFBIJgkj_-g

This next one is also from Händel. While not particularly seasonal it is utterly magnificent. From Judas Maccabaeus— https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p1BedwyFKY

Hope you enjoy
The tune to the second one is the same as Thine be the glory. I think my palate has been ruined because although I can see why this is good I don't tend to go back and listen to it.
I was into Handel much more than I am now many years ago before I discarded Christianity. It had an additional resonance when I was still a believer that I don’t enjoy now, alas. But I still recognize it as great music and listen to it now and again. It evokes a sense of majesty that to me at least is pretty self-evident. It’s like a fine cheese. You enjoy it but it isn’t really appropriate for everyday listening

Moonwood the Hare wrote:
Sun Dec 29, 2019 10:25 pm
When you appreciate this stuff, which has these Christian themes, is it something in the structure. Andrew Rilstone had something intetesting about this and Richard Dawkins liking for Christian music. I've dug it and will quote it because I think there is something quite clever about the reasoning here:
When he was on Desert Island Discs, Dawkins selected an excerpt from Bach's St Matthew Passion as one of his favourite records. He pretends not to understand why normal people thought this was a bit odd.
The interviewer asked me how I could choose religious music without being religious. You might as well say, how can you enjoy Wuthering Heights when you know perfectly well that Cathy and Heathcliff never really existed.
This is another blustering non sequitur. Emily Bronte believed that Heathcliff was a fictional character and presented her book as a work of fiction. Bach believed Jesus was a real person, and presented his Passion as a retelling of and meditation on events that he thought really happened. Bronte wrote a story which she hoped would surprise and excite and delight her readers; Bach composed a piece of music which he hoped would bring his listeners closer to God. The question of whether a work is presented as fiction or non-fiction as a profound effect on the way we read it. Would Robinson Crusoe be the same book it were discovered to be the real diary of a real castaway? Would you even bother to read The Diary of Anne Frank if it turned out to be a work of fiction? No, the fact that Bach believed Jesus to be a real person doesn't mean that his music can only be enjoyed by people who think the same. There would be nothing at all surprising about someone saying 'The story of Jesus dying and rising again is a beautiful story and I love to listen to it, but unlike Bach, I don't think that it is really true.' People say things of the same kind every day. I myself don't believe Time was incarnate in a person called Krishna but I might put the Indian language Maharbarata on the short list of Greatest TV Shows Not Featuring a Police Box. But Dawkins doesn't think that the story of the passion of the Christ is a beautiful story. He thinks it is 'sadomasochistic', 'barking mad', 'viciously unpleasant', 'tortuously nasty' and incidentally, that the people who disseminate it are worse than child molesters. What is going on when someone says that a musical celebration of a perverted, insane, vicious, unpleasant, nasty story is the one of eight things he couldn't manage without on a desert island? Dawkins pretends that he thinks that Sue Lawley thinks that it's odd that someone who doesn't believe in Jesus would want to listen to songs about Jesus. I'm sure she doesn't think anything nearly so silly. What she probably thinks is odd is that someone who finds a particular story horrible should want to listen to it over and over again. It's a bit like a noted black man who's campaigned all his life for racial equality saying that Birth of a Nation is his favourite movie. It's possible, of course: maybe he admires the camera work, or finds that it helps him understand how racists think. But he wouldn't come over all wounded if Ms. Lawley asked him why.
http://www.andrewrilstone.com/2007/05/w ... p-for.html
Is it something in the structure? Of course. Read the lyrics without the musical accompaniment and ask yourself if the lyrics alone convey the same sense of power or majesty.

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Moonwood the Hare
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by Moonwood the Hare »

captain howdy wrote:
Fri Jan 03, 2020 5:23 am
I was into Handel much more than I am now many years ago before I discarded Christianity. It had an additional resonance when I was still a believer that I don’t enjoy now, alas. But I still recognize it as great music and listen to it now and again. It evokes a sense of majesty that to me at least is pretty self-evident. It’s like a fine cheese. You enjoy it but it isn’t really appropriate for everyday listening
Okay, I get that. I went to see a performance of the Mysteries, adapted by atheist poet Tony Harrison a few weeks ago. I think Harrison had recognised some of the grandeur of the text and sometimes that came through. The problem was that they had replaced most of the jokes with less good jokes and topical references. Playing Mary and Joseph as a stroppy teenager and her paetner just did not work. There are a lot of jokes aimed at Joseph in the text but this just kept missing them. It left me thinking, if as an atheist I wanted to do the Mystery plays how would I make that work for atheists. the producers had tried to latch onto themse of concern for people like LGBT and trans rights but having drag queens seranading Noah with 'It's Raining Men' just seemed garish and trivial. That sense of importance of majesty you find in Mendal and which I could feel in parts of the the texts of these Medieval plays must have analogues in atheism, in say the moral grandeur of Camus which transcends the absurdism of which he is aware. In Marx of course, but who, apart from our earstwhile shadow chancellor, himself a cultural Catholic, responds to that these days?
Is it something in the structure? Of course. Read the lyrics without the musical accompaniment and ask yourself if the lyrics alone convey the same sense of power or majesty.
I keep thinking of the Walter Pater quote.
“All art constantly aspires towards the condition of music. For while in all other kinds of art it is possible to distinguish the matter from the form, and the understanding can always make this distinction, yet it is the constant effort of art to obliterate it.”

Rian
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by Rian »

Moonwood the Hare wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 6:57 pm
searchengineguy wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 6:35 pm
Claire should buy two ticets, but I'm not sure whether she can follow straight on after two deliberate plus a naive typo?
Are you playing the Old Australian rules or the revised Queensland rules?
seg wrote:I play doddering Australian rules these days.
I remember the year I eked out a win by using the American London Bridge option! :D

Hope everyone had a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year and a wonderful holiday time with friends and family!

searchengineguy
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Re: Merry Xmas All!

Post by searchengineguy »

Rian wrote:
Wed Jan 08, 2020 4:00 am
I remember the year I eked out a win by using the American London Bridge option! :D

Hope everyone had a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year and a wonderful holiday time with friends and family!
Gee thanks Rian, lovely to hear from you again!
“One would go mad if one took the Bible seriously; but to take it seriously one must be already mad.”
Aleister Crowley

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