Miracle on the Mountain.

Create a topic and discuss! No subject is off limits, but moderators have the right to remove asshat posts. What's an asshat post? Selling stuff, trolling, harassing--the usual stuff you don't want to see either. Happy posting!
Claire
Posts: 1292
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:25 am

Re: Miracle on the Mountain.

Post by Claire » Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:38 pm

Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:This particular circumstance was miraculous for reasons explained.
Nope, that doesn't fly. It has to be extraordinary and not explicable by natural or scientific laws.
How was our rescue not extraordinary, and explicable by natural, or scientific laws? And, please give something resembling an actual explanation, and don't just say ''science and natural law explains it", as if that ends the conversation.
SEG wrote:Co-incidence. You two got lucky. It happens. Big deal.
Lol, since you say luckdidit, how is that explicable by natural, or scientific laws in this case?
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:Who do you think owned this mysterious voice? Why?
I'm not our rescuer, Luke, who claimed to have been guided to us. So, if you're looking to challenge the source of that guidance, it's possible my thought may differ from his, therefore any criticism might be based on a false assumption of his position.

For the purpose of this conversation, I think it's more important for you to offer your explanation. Was it a symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying? You say I'm gullible, so there must be reason for saying that, right?
Correct. You reach for fantasy when you don't understand strange things happening.
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:However, never did I not understand. And, since you somehow know what the source of the voice wasn't, what was? A symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying?
I don't know I wasn't there.
Yet, you know luck was involved in our being rescued by Luke, even though you weren't there, lol. I suppose it was bad luck that the rangers and others didn't find us? Regarding the source of the voice that Luke says led him to us, which do you think is more likely? A symptom of mental illness? Or, was he lying?

User avatar
SEG
Posts: 2027
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:59 pm

Re: Miracle on the Mountain.

Post by SEG » Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:50 pm

Lying. Believers can't help themselves.
Premise One: If a compassionate God exists, then he would do things just as a compassionate person would.
Premise Two: God doesn't do things as a compassionate person would.
Conclusion: Therefore, a compassionate God does not exist.

Claire
Posts: 1292
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:25 am

Re: Miracle on the Mountain.

Post by Claire » Sun Sep 15, 2019 6:33 am

Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:This particular circumstance was miraculous for reasons explained.
Nope, that doesn't fly. It has to be extraordinary and not explicable by natural or scientific laws.
How was our rescue not extraordinary, and explicable by natural, or scientific laws? And, please give something resembling an actual explanation, and don't just say ''science and natural law explains it", as if that ends the conversation.
SEG wrote:Co-incidence. You two got lucky. It happens. Big deal.
Lol, since you say luckdidit, how is that explicable by natural, or scientific laws in this case?
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:Who do you think owned this mysterious voice? Why?
I'm not our rescuer, Luke, who claimed to have been guided to us. So, if you're looking to challenge the source of that guidance, it's possible my thought may differ from his, therefore any criticism might be based on a false assumption of his position.

For the purpose of this conversation, I think it's more important for you to offer your explanation. Was it a symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying? You say I'm gullible, so there must be reason for saying that, right?
Correct. You reach for fantasy when you don't understand strange things happening.
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:However, never did I not understand. And, since you somehow know what the source of the voice wasn't, what was? A symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying?
I don't know I wasn't there.
Yet, you know luck was involved in our being rescued by Luke, even though you weren't there, lol. I suppose it was bad luck that the rangers and others didn't find us? Regarding the source of the voice that Luke says led him to us, which do you think is more likely? A symptom of mental illness? Or, was he lying?
SEG wrote:Lying. Believers can't help themselves.
I never said Luke believed in God, because at no point did he explicitly say, or imply that he was. If he's not a believer, does that mean you won't automatically assume lying is the most likely explanation?

User avatar
SEG
Posts: 2027
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:59 pm

Re: Miracle on the Mountain.

Post by SEG » Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:44 am

Claire wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 6:33 am
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Nope, that doesn't fly. It has to be extraordinary and not explicable by natural or scientific laws.
How was our rescue not extraordinary, and explicable by natural, or scientific laws? And, please give something resembling an actual explanation, and don't just say ''science and natural law explains it", as if that ends the conversation.
SEG wrote:Co-incidence. You two got lucky. It happens. Big deal.
Lol, since you say luckdidit, how is that explicable by natural, or scientific laws in this case?
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:
I'm not our rescuer, Luke, who claimed to have been guided to us. So, if you're looking to challenge the source of that guidance, it's possible my thought may differ from his, therefore any criticism might be based on a false assumption of his position.

For the purpose of this conversation, I think it's more important for you to offer your explanation. Was it a symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying? You say I'm gullible, so there must be reason for saying that, right?
Correct. You reach for fantasy when you don't understand strange things happening.
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
I don't know I wasn't there.
Yet, you know luck was involved in our being rescued by Luke, even though you weren't there, lol. I suppose it was bad luck that the rangers and others didn't find us? Regarding the source of the voice that Luke says led him to us, which do you think is more likely? A symptom of mental illness? Or, was he lying?
SEG wrote:Lying. Believers can't help themselves.
I never said Luke believed in God, because at no point did he explicitly say, or imply that he was. If he's not a believer, does that mean you won't automatically assume lying is the most likely explanation?
Nope, lot's of people have mental issues, especially believers in woo.
Premise One: If a compassionate God exists, then he would do things just as a compassionate person would.
Premise Two: God doesn't do things as a compassionate person would.
Conclusion: Therefore, a compassionate God does not exist.

Claire
Posts: 1292
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:25 am

Re: Miracle on the Mountain.

Post by Claire » Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:26 am

Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:This particular circumstance was miraculous for reasons explained.
Nope, that doesn't fly. It has to be extraordinary and not explicable by natural or scientific laws.
How was our rescue not extraordinary, and explicable by natural, or scientific laws? And, please give something resembling an actual explanation, and don't just say ''science and natural law explains it", as if that ends the conversation.
SEG wrote:Co-incidence. You two got lucky. It happens. Big deal.
Lol, since you say luckdidit, how is that explicable by natural, or scientific laws in this case?
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:Who do you think owned this mysterious voice? Why?
I'm not our rescuer, Luke, who claimed to have been guided to us. So, if you're looking to challenge the source of that guidance, it's possible my thought may differ from his, therefore any criticism might be based on a false assumption of his position.

For the purpose of this conversation, I think it's more important for you to offer your explanation. Was it a symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying? You say I'm gullible, so there must be reason for saying that, right?
Correct. You reach for fantasy when you don't understand strange things happening.
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:However, never did I not understand. And, since you somehow know what the source of the voice wasn't, what was? A symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying?
I don't know I wasn't there.
Yet, you know luck was involved in our being rescued by Luke, even though you weren't there, lol. I suppose it was bad luck that the rangers and others didn't find us? Regarding the source of the voice that Luke says led him to us, which do you think is more likely? A symptom of mental illness? Or, was he lying?
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:Lying. Believers can't help themselves.
I never said Luke believed in God, because at no point did he explicitly say, or imply that he was. If he's not a believer, does that mean you won't automatically assume lying is the most likely explanation?
Nope, lot's of people have mental issues, especially believers in woo.
So, it was only lying and luck when you thought he was a believer. Now, when your told he's not, its mental illness and luck. Well, to be clear, the "voice" wasn't audible, rather he felt instructed and guided by "something", and didn't attribute that something to anything specific. He was visibly dumbfounded describing the experience, and aware he made the conscious choice to obey. If you still think mental illness is a factor, such behavior is a symptom of what mental illness exactly?

User avatar
SEG
Posts: 2027
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:59 pm

Re: Miracle on the Mountain.

Post by SEG » Mon Sep 16, 2019 1:17 pm

I don't know, I'm not a doctor. What do you think happened? It seems very ordinary to me. It doesn't take much for you to jump to supernatural explanations, does it?
Premise One: If a compassionate God exists, then he would do things just as a compassionate person would.
Premise Two: God doesn't do things as a compassionate person would.
Conclusion: Therefore, a compassionate God does not exist.

Claire
Posts: 1292
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:25 am

Re: Miracle on the Mountain.

Post by Claire » Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:26 am

Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:This particular circumstance was miraculous for reasons explained.
Nope, that doesn't fly. It has to be extraordinary and not explicable by natural or scientific laws.
How was our rescue not extraordinary, and explicable by natural, or scientific laws? And, please give something resembling an actual explanation, and don't just say ''science and natural law explains it", as if that ends the conversation.
SEG wrote:Co-incidence. You two got lucky. It happens. Big deal.
Lol, since you say luckdidit, how is that explicable by natural, or scientific laws in this case?
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:Who do you think owned this mysterious voice? Why?
I'm not our rescuer, Luke, who claimed to have been guided to us. So, if you're looking to challenge the source of that guidance, it's possible my thought may differ from his, therefore any criticism might be based on a false assumption of his position.

For the purpose of this conversation, I think it's more important for you to offer your explanation. Was it a symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying? You say I'm gullible, so there must be reason for saying that, right?
Correct. You reach for fantasy when you don't understand strange things happening.
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:However, never did I not understand. And, since you somehow know what the source of the voice wasn't, what was? A symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying?
I don't know I wasn't there.
Yet, you know luck was involved in our being rescued by Luke, even though you weren't there, lol. I suppose it was bad luck that the rangers and others didn't find us? Regarding the source of the voice that Luke says led him to us, which do you think is more likely? A symptom of mental illness? Or, was he lying?
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:Lying. Believers can't help themselves.
I never said Luke believed in God, because at no point did he explicitly say, or imply that he was. If he's not a believer, does that mean you won't automatically assume lying is the most likely explanation?
Nope, lot's of people have mental issues, especially believers in woo.
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:So, it was only lying and luck when you thought he was a believer. Now, when your told he's not, its mental illness and luck. Well, to be clear, the "voice" wasn't audible, rather he felt instructed and guided by "something", and didn't attribute that something to anything specific. He was visibly dumbfounded describing the experience, and aware he made the conscious choice to obey. If you still think mental illness is a factor, such behavior is a symptom of what mental illness exactly?
I don't know, I'm not a doctor.
Yet, you indicated he could be mentally ill, but you don't have to be a doctor to research mental illnesses, and form an opinion about which might fit Luke's behavior. So, if you still think mental illness is a factor then be specific, or take mental illness off the table until you can.
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:This particular circumstance was miraculous for reasons explained.
Nope, that doesn't fly. It has to be extraordinary and not explicable by natural or scientific laws.
How was our rescue not extraordinary, and explicable by natural, or scientific laws? And, please give something resembling an actual explanation, and don't just say ''science and natural law explains it", as if that ends the conversation.
SEG wrote:Co-incidence. You two got lucky. It happens. Big deal.
Lol, since you say luckdidit, how is that explicable by natural, or scientific laws in this case?
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:Who do you think owned this mysterious voice? Why?
I'm not our rescuer, Luke, who claimed to have been guided to us. So, if you're looking to challenge the source of that guidance, it's possible my thought may differ from his, therefore any criticism might be based on a false assumption of his position.

For the purpose of this conversation, I think it's more important for you to offer your explanation. Was it a symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying? You say I'm gullible, so there must be reason for saying that, right?
Correct. You reach for fantasy when you don't understand strange things happening.
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:However, never did I not understand. And, since you somehow know what the source of the voice wasn't, what was? A symptom of mental disorder? Was Luke lying?
I don't know I wasn't there.
Yet, you know luck was involved in our being rescued by Luke, even though you weren't there, lol. I suppose it was bad luck that the rangers and others didn't find us? Regarding the source of the voice that Luke says led him to us, which do you think is more likely? A symptom of mental illness? Or, was he lying?
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:
SEG wrote:Lying. Believers can't help themselves.
I never said Luke believed in God, because at no point did he explicitly say, or imply that he was. If he's not a believer, does that mean you won't automatically assume lying is the most likely explanation?
Nope, lot's of people have mental issues, especially believers in woo.
SEG wrote:
Claire wrote:So, it was only lying and luck when you thought he was a believer. Now, when your told he's not, its mental illness and luck. Well, to be clear, the "voice" wasn't audible, rather he felt instructed and guided by "something", and didn't attribute that something to anything specific. He was visibly dumbfounded describing the experience, and aware he made the conscious choice to obey. If you still think mental illness is a factor, such behavior is a symptom of what mental illness exactly?
I don't know, I'm not a doctor.
Yet, you indicated he could be mentally ill, but you don't have to be a doctor to research mental illnesses, and form an opinion about which might fit Luke's behavior. So, if you still think mental illness is a factor then be specific.
SEG wrote:What do you think happened? It seems very ordinary to me. It doesn't take much for you to jump to supernatural explanations, does it?
So, first it was lying, then it was a non-specific mental illness, and now it's an ordinary phenomena? What does that mean? Luke's now an honest, sane person who had an ordinary experience?

Post Reply