Letter to Emery & Scott RE. Carico -and a poll for the rest

[OzAnt]

Hi CLM,

Does she really strike you as the type to be savvy enough to bypass IP addresses and such?

No, that's why I specifically said

Also, pure dumb luck (eg: her changing internet providers)...

Note too, that whenever I reset my modem, I'm generally assigned a new IP address by my Internet Service Provider (ISP) from a 'pool' of IP addresses assigned to my ISP (I'd have to pay my ISP extra to have a dedicated IP address).

Now, I've never hosted/moderated a forum (ie, I can't speak from experience), but if Emery banned User + IP address, I'm imagining [that if her ISP works the same way mine does] she could stumble back in simply if she's had her modem turned off for a while (because, say, God forgot to remind her to pay her electricity bill) and then turned it back on and tried to log in (ie, her ISP would assign her a different IP address).

Much like anyone in life, everyone should begin with a clean slate when you meet them and a forum is no exception. A few years ago I was the owner of a forum that hosted a little over 2300 active users and I only had one other person tasked to moderate it. This forum was part of a website that was geared towards people 13 - 25 and and so you can imagine how many "Carico's" I dealt with.

This is precisely why I think Emery allows this forum to moderate itself to the extent that it does (so much less work). He's worked out that people like Carico eventually go away if we ignore 'em for long enough.

Trolls like Carico do what they do because it's easy. If they have free reign over a forum they'll take full advantage of that. This forum is perfect for someone like her because she has very little, to no resistance.

I would have thought so too, but my experience on this forum over the last couple years is that they eventually give up.

It is the nature of this topic that we'll get nut jobs on either side and I think it should be policy that every nut gets treated equally until they prove they're not capable or interested of having a decent conversation. Carico has proven time and time again she is not interested in anything we stand for here.

I dunno, CLM. I was once a fundie type of Christian. Whilst I don't believe I'd ever have sounded as unhinged as Carico, it's kind of sobering to see the path I was once headed down. I'm not even convinced she's a nut-job. She certainly comes across as one, but then I recognise that I'm losing respect for any adult that believes in an invisible entity and believes it's their invisible entity's command/desire to get me to believe in it too. That said, I'm not sure where she gets her ideas on magnetic particles stopping us floating off the planet or where she gets the idea that cats have simply 'forgotten' to be herbivores... Okay, maybe she's a little nuttier than your typical Rocky Road candy bar...

But see, this is what I was getting at in my previous post though; at the moment I can go to Encyclopedia Dramatica and look up Carico and make an easy decision to ignore the poster. If Carico was to log under a new name, it would involve my time and effort to work out whether I should ignore her or not. That would annoy me more is all I'm saying.

Ant

[Rian]

CLM continues to feed the troll.

Argh, I can't help it!! It's like playing those stupid games at the carnival. You know you can't win, but you just keep throwing $5 at the game carnie because all it takes is one ring around the bottle to win that giant panda that looks like it was put together by a blind man with no arms and a bad knee! I refuse to believe the game is rigged....in this case however, I think we're all getting cheated.

Yeah, I know what you mean ... it took me ages to finally put one person on ignore - you just keep thinking it's GOT to change! It's very hard to decide to stop talking with someone - I've only put one person on ignore in all my years on the internet.

I just read the bday thread, and ... wow

Emery, do you have something between banning and not banning? At another board I'm on, there are suspensions for varying amounts of time, depending on the offense and how many warnings there have been. Perhaps this might be a good solution - it might break the posting habit. Maybe add some rules that after 3 suspensions, the member is banned (unless it's some raging offense that deserves immediate banning)

And I agree with Pseudo - I'm fond of CLM and would hate to lose him (and one of these days I'd like to hear the story behind his name!), and I don't see any significant contributions from Carico - maybe try a 2-week ban for her?

ps - marc - gee, thanks Come on, was that insult-by-name really necessary to the health of the forum? Why do you throw that type of thing in? Do you also complain about the fact that there are so few Christians at the board?

[marc]

ps - marc - gee, thanks Come on, was that insult-by-name really necessary to the health of the forum? Why do you throw that type of thing in? Do you also complain about the fact that there are so few Christians at the board?

Rian, I almost went back and edited your name out figuring you'd comment on it. I decided against it because, while disrespectful, I didn't think it was that disrespectful.

While I have my issues with your and Tony's "understanding" of science you both have always been respectful to me on this board and I respect you both as people unlike Carico (although I most definitely do not respect how you treat science). I apologize for singling you (and Tony) out. Take a quick gander at that Tony B-day thread and look at who started it (I'll save you the trouble ... I did). Although I do not like your or Tony's religious points of view, I bet we'd all get along in person as long as religion didn't come up in conversation. You are correct, it was probably not and again, I apologize for singling you guys out.

BTW, no, I do not complain about the lack of Christians on the board.

[Rian]

Thank you for the very generous apology

Yes, I saw that you started the thread, and that made me very happy - I thought that it was very kind and tolerant.

[Emery]

Alright guys, her account has been deactivated. It can still be reactivated, so Carico, email me if you'd like to make your case.

[crazylegsmurphy]

Praise the Lord!!

[marc]

Thanks Emery!!!!

BTW, I was poking around some user profiles recently, yours still says "law student". Thought you'd like to know so you can change it, I know how excited you are about that phase of your life being behind you.

[wondersforoyarsa]

I'm a little late to the angry mob, but I'll add my incensed "burn her" to the rest of the auto da fe chorus.

By the way, Jeff, I do think we ought to respect old people at least enough not to rubbish their views because they are old (anymore than they should rubbish what we say simply because we are young). I'm sure Carico brought it on herself with a vengeance - I'm just spouting my skycop-morality is all...

[crazylegsmurphy]

I'm a little late to the angry mob, but I'll add my incensed "burn her" to the rest of the auto da fe chorus.

By the way, Jeff, I do think we ought to respect old people at least enough not to rubbish their views because they are old (anymore than they should rubbish what we say simply because we are young). I'm sure Carico brought it on herself with a vengeance - I'm just spouting my skycop-morality is all...

I was waiting for someone to comment on that. The cool thing about those quotes about age was that she was really careful to cut out anything to do with what context those were taken in. At first, I was trying to get her to understand that the evolutionary science she said she was taught in school is now 30 some years out of date. Her reply to this was of course to use it as further proof scientists are telling lies.

Oh, I forgot something I wanted to tell you. You said in a post that you were brainwashed by evolution when you were in school....aren't you like 50 some years old? Do you realize how long ago that was?

Seriously....are you aware they no longer use 8-tracks and Beta tapes?

Do you have any idea of how much has changed in science in evolution in the last 30 some years? Do you have ANY clue at all? (That's rhetorical by the way...I know you don't)

Of course this has nothing to do with people over the age of 50, it was a poor attempt to get her to realize that holding onto outdated information and using it as the basis of her argument was the equvilant to old people saying, "Back in my day....."

Her response of course was,

Yes I know how much science has changed. That's because their old stories weren't true any ore than their stories today are. So by the time you're 50 (if you reach that age), the stories of scientists will be different again. So thanks for proving my point that scientists can't be trusted because they keep changing their stories. You did a much better job of proving that than I did. So you've just made my day.

I then snapped even more at this point. Keep in mind I was trying to keep this confined to PM's so none of you had to deal with it. I wrote:

I usually don't say this to people, but I take great solace in knowing you're pushing 60 and aren't long for this world. We don't need dinosaurs like you on our planet pushing your nonsense. You better pray that all the sinning you're doing on all these forums will be forgiven, because there is no question that is what you're doing with your attitude and your ignorance.

Again, this had nothing to do with the age of people in general, or lack of respect for anyone of this age. I was trying to explain to her that if she has no intention of changing or learning, then to me her life is over anyway. I didn't see how it was right that she felt we all needed to be reminded how stupid we all were for believing in something, and trying to find the answers, when this old coot was just spouting off nonsense.

She of course..responded with,

Since dinosaurs are as much artwork as neanderthals are, then you won't have to worry about them existing in today's day and age. Your contradictions are out there for all to see.

And I in turn,

Apparently you're too stupid to understand what I mean. Let me put it more simple for your old ass.

We don't need people with outdated ideas like you because they do nothing to forward humanity. You're irrelevant in today's world.

It went on from there, but I hope you can see that this was not specifically about age, but about her being old and set in her ways. No disrespect intended to anyone over the age of 50, the real problem is you young jerks who think you know everything, don't you understand how bloody wrong you are?

[wondersforoyarsa]

Well, I sided with you on your vote. I don't think that heated exchange with her was your finest hour though. I know plenty of old folks who are set in their ways, and yet are respectful and courteous, and even wise. Perhaps you'll agree?

[crazylegsmurphy]

Well, I sided with you on your vote. I don't think that heated exchange with her was your finest hour though. I know plenty of old folks who are set in their ways, and yet are respectful and courteous, and even wise. Perhaps you'll agree?

I think it was my finest hour, I got her pretty riled up enough to say some stupid things.....which was all according to plan.....muhahahhaaaaa muuahahahahhahhahah!!!

Ya, and if she was respectful and courteous, and even a shred of wise I don't think it would have ever been an issue. I mean look at Mitch, that guy is like 84 years old, but he's respectful and such. I have nothing against old people, or young people, or dead people....I just can't stand ignorant jerk people. like me!

[wondersforoyarsa]

Ya, and if she was respectful and courteous, and even a shred of wise I don't think it would have ever been an issue. I mean look at Mitch, that guy is like 84 years old, but he's respectful and such. I have nothing against old people, or young people, or dead people....I just can't stand ignorant jerk people. like me!

I'll drink to being an ignorant jerk!

[marc]

Ya, and if she was respectful and courteous, and even a shred of wise I don't think it would have ever been an issue. I mean look at Mitch, that guy is like 84 years old, but he's respectful and such. I have nothing against old people, or young people, or dead people....I just can't stand ignorant jerk people. like me!

I'll drink to being an ignorant jerk!

I'll get the next round for all of us

[Emery]

Thanks Emery!!!!

BTW, I was poking around some user profiles recently, yours still says "law student". Thought you'd like to know so you can change it, I know how excited you are about that phase of your life being behind you.

Thanks Marc. I'm in limbo now (proof to the Catholic church that limbo still exists, at least for law students) until the bar exam results come in at the end of the month. So officially to the Bar I'm known as an "applicant." At the office I'm a "lawyer wannabe." So, perhaps I'll keep the law student title for a little longer

[Rian]

Sounds like now's the perfect time to get your official Ambulance-Chaser car in top form so you can hit the ground running (driving?) as soon as you hear the good news (we just KNOW you passed! )