The work Jesus began

Where Christians can talk among themselves, and about those Godless atheists.

Re: The work Jesus began

Postby cleve » Tue Jul 18, 2017 8:50 pm

1.) We Shall Daily Ignore The Flesh, And Deny All Its Calls And Claims. We have to remember that though we are “not in the flesh”, the flesh is in us, and that we can never get rid of it till rapture, death, or resurrection. If we fail to keep this in daily remembrance we are at the mercy of every false teacher; liable to fall into any error which may spring up; and to be led astray into any of the new fashions and modern methods, the tricks and contrivances of fleshly religion. All these errors in doctrine and practice come from this one source. This source is the acknowledging of the claims and capabilities of the old nature. It is the essence and foundation of all false religions, as seen in the Church of Rome and elsewhere. We have it set forth in one sentence in a Roman Catholic book? “We are commanded by Jesus suffering and dying for us to imitate Him by the crucifixion of our flesh, and by acts of daily mortification.”
Wherein does this differ from the popular holiness teaching of the present day? True, it may be put in a different way; it may be looked at from other points of view; but this is the ultimate end, aim, and. object of all who cultivate or attend to the claims of the old nature. The means employed or recommended may vary: but the result desired is one and the same, viz., to arrive at a state of sinlessness more or less. All this comes from one root, the flesh, with all its claims and calls, is not ignored as being “as good as dead”.
If this practical duty be not attended to, the door stands wide open for every form of error that may choose to enter. If we can bear this responsibility in daily remembrance, it will keep us from embarking on any efforts, plans, or schemes which have for their object the cultivation or improvement of the flesh. It will preserve us also from any form of modern teaching which would excite the hope that, by following certain rules, the flesh can be eradicated. Both hopes are absolutely groundless, and can end only in grievous disappointment. Let us make no mistake as to this first fundamental fact, and then we shall not be misled by false hopes that, by suitable food and training, we can change flesh into spirit: or that, by mortifying it in any way, we can get rid of it.
2.) The Best Practical Way of Treating The Old Nature Is To Starve It, by keeping it on low diet. But this cannot be done directly by making that an aim or a “work”. It can be done only indirectly by constantly attending to the claims and desires, and satisfying the ever heaven-ascending longings of the new nature. We have seen that the food of the new nature is the Word of God. While we are directly feeding upon that we are indirectly starving the old nature. For (and this is the important fact) we cannot be feeding both natures at the same time! The nourishment on which the one nature thrives will starve the other. And this fact cuts both ways. If we are feeding the old nature on man’s books and man’s teachings, we shall be keeping the new nature ill-fed, impoverished and weak. The old nature will thrive on general literature. But the new nature will thrive only on the Word of God. His words “are spirit, and they are life” (John 6:63); and only what is spiritual can be assimilated by spirit. Bible understanding.com
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby cleve » Wed Jul 19, 2017 5:03 am

1V. THE CHARACTER AND END OF THE NEW NATURE

We are now in a position to consider what we are taught as to the new nature itself. We have looked at its various tides and characteristics; and now we wish to learn what is said about its character and end.
1.) It Cannot be Changed. In this respect it is like the old nature: “That which is born of the Spirit is spirit”, and remains spirit (John 3:6). No known power can ever change it into flesh; or alter its character. It is divine in its origin, and perfect in its nature (I John 3:9, 18). Its origin is the Spirit of God (John 6:63). Its instrument is the Word of God (1 Pet. 1:22, 23; John 6:63). It is not altered or affected by any of the frailties, infirmities, or sins of the flesh. By it we are made the sons of God; and it is the token to us that God is our Father. The gift of this new nature, or spirit, is called our “sealing”, which is ours on believing (Eph. 1:13). Once we really learn and believe this blessed fact it becomes difficult, if not impossible, for us to pray: “take not” Thy Holy Spirit from us.” No! God will never take away from His children that new spirit which He has put within them: for “the gifts and calling of God are without change of mind”, (Rom. 11:29). If Israel, though cast off (not cast away) for a season, is “beloved for the fathers’ sakes” (Rom. 11:28), the sons of God are beloved for His own sake. For, as it is written in Romans 8:30 “Whom He did predestinate [to be conformed to the image of His Son, 5:29] them He called also: and whom He called, them He justified also: and whom He justified, them He glorified also.” Grace ensures glory: for “the Lord will give grace and glory” (Ps. 84:11). If He gives the grace it is the pledge that He will give the glory. It must be so. He will not make us “perfect in Christ Jesus” (Col. 1:28) and then adjudge us imperfect. He will not make Christ to be our righteousness and holiness (1 Cor. 1:30) and then unmake His own work.
If we are once “complete” in Christ (Co1. 2:10) we cannot become incomplete. He will not deny or forsake the work of His own hands (Ps. 138:8). This mystery or secret was “ordained by God before the world”: and this is specially declared to have been “with a view to our glory” (1 Cor.2:7). We may be perfectly sure therefore that His purpose cannot and will not fail; and that it will end in “our glory”. The new nature, given by the pure grace of God, will necessarily end in the eternal glory of God. It came from God, and must return to God. This new nature cannot be forfeited–No, not even by sin: for even this contingency is provided for in I John 2:1, 2, “If any man sin we have an Advocate with the Father Jesus Christ the righteous, and He is [and remains] the propitiation for our sins.” It is this connection, with sinning, that we are reminded that God is still our “Father” and that we are still His children: that our relationship has not been broken. “If any man sin”; What then? In that contingency we are not told what we are, but what Christ is. We are not reminded of what we have done, but what He has done. We are not turned upon ourselves and our confession, but we are directed upward to Christ and His position. Our thoughts are not occupied with our humiliation, but with Christ’s “propitiation”: that is always before the Father; for Christ is there, and we are there in Him. Our confession was made once for all when we, by grace, took the place of the lost sinner (1 John 1:9); and when we laid our hand, by faith, on Christ as the sin-offering, and there owned ourselves as lost sinners. Then we were “sealed” (on this believing); and our position and standing before God was secured and assured by the gift of the new nature. So secure is our standing in Christ that two Advocates, or Comforters, are provided. The word is Parakletos and means, one called to one’s side for help, comfort, advocacy or for whatever one may need. It occurs only in John’s writings, and is translated “Comforter” in his Gospel, and “Advocate” in his Epistle.

But the fact remains that Christ tells us in the Gospel that we have one Advocate (the Holy Spirit) with us, that we may not sin: and the Holy Spirit tells us in the Epistle that we have another Advocate (Jesus Christ the righteous One) with the Father, if we do sin. So that all is foreknown, foreseen, and provided for; and nothing can forfeit this wondrous gift of God. Nor will God ever recall His gift, or take from us that spirit, or new nature, which He implanted in us, His sons, when He thus sealed us as His children.
2.) The new nature is “Life and Peace” (Rom. 8:6). The body is dead (i.e., reckoned as having died on account of sin, but the spirit (or new nature) is life on account of righteousness...Bibleunderstanding.com
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby kjw47 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 12:10 pm

cleve wrote:1V. THE CHARACTER AND END OF THE NEW NATURE

We are now in a position to consider what we are taught as to the new nature itself. We have looked at its various tides and characteristics; and now we wish to learn what is said about its character and end.
1.) It Cannot be Changed. In this respect it is like the old nature: “That which is born of the Spirit is spirit”, and remains spirit (John 3:6). No known power can ever change it into flesh; or alter its character. It is divine in its origin, and perfect in its nature (I John 3:9, 18). Its origin is the Spirit of God (John 6:63). Its instrument is the Word of God (1 Pet. 1:22, 23; John 6:63). It is not altered or affected by any of the frailties, infirmities, or sins of the flesh. By it we are made the sons of God; and it is the token to us that God is our Father. The gift of this new nature, or spirit, is called our “sealing”, which is ours on believing (Eph. 1:13). Once we really learn and believe this blessed fact it becomes difficult, if not impossible, for us to pray: “take not” Thy Holy Spirit from us.” No! God will never take away from His children that new spirit which He has put within them: for “the gifts and calling of God are without change of mind”, (Rom. 11:29). If Israel, though cast off (not cast away) for a season, is “beloved for the fathers’ sakes” (Rom. 11:28), the sons of God are beloved for His own sake. For, as it is written in Romans 8:30 “Whom He did predestinate [to be conformed to the image of His Son, 5:29] them He called also: and whom He called, them He justified also: and whom He justified, them He glorified also.” Grace ensures glory: for “the Lord will give grace and glory” (Ps. 84:11). If He gives the grace it is the pledge that He will give the glory. It must be so. He will not make us “perfect in Christ Jesus” (Col. 1:28) and then adjudge us imperfect. He will not make Christ to be our righteousness and holiness (1 Cor. 1:30) and then unmake His own work.
If we are once “complete” in Christ (Co1. 2:10) we cannot become incomplete. He will not deny or forsake the work of His own hands (Ps. 138:8). This mystery or secret was “ordained by God before the world”: and this is specially declared to have been “with a view to our glory” (1 Cor.2:7). We may be perfectly sure therefore that His purpose cannot and will not fail; and that it will end in “our glory”. The new nature, given by the pure grace of God, will necessarily end in the eternal glory of God. It came from God, and must return to God. This new nature cannot be forfeited–No, not even by sin: for even this contingency is provided for in I John 2:1, 2, “If any man sin we have an Advocate with the Father Jesus Christ the righteous, and He is [and remains] the propitiation for our sins.” It is this connection, with sinning, that we are reminded that God is still our “Father” and that we are still His children: that our relationship has not been broken. “If any man sin”; What then? In that contingency we are not told what we are, but what Christ is. We are not reminded of what we have done, but what He has done. We are not turned upon ourselves and our confession, but we are directed upward to Christ and His position. Our thoughts are not occupied with our humiliation, but with Christ’s “propitiation”: that is always before the Father; for Christ is there, and we are there in Him. Our confession was made once for all when we, by grace, took the place of the lost sinner (1 John 1:9); and when we laid our hand, by faith, on Christ as the sin-offering, and there owned ourselves as lost sinners. Then we were “sealed” (on this believing); and our position and standing before God was secured and assured by the gift of the new nature. So secure is our standing in Christ that two Advocates, or Comforters, are provided. The word is Parakletos and means, one called to one’s side for help, comfort, advocacy or for whatever one may need. It occurs only in John’s writings, and is translated “Comforter” in his Gospel, and “Advocate” in his Epistle.

But the fact remains that Christ tells us in the Gospel that we have one Advocate (the Holy Spirit) with us, that we may not sin: and the Holy Spirit tells us in the Epistle that we have another Advocate (Jesus Christ the righteous One) with the Father, if we do sin. So that all is foreknown, foreseen, and provided for; and nothing can forfeit this wondrous gift of God. Nor will God ever recall His gift, or take from us that spirit, or new nature, which He implanted in us, His sons, when He thus sealed us as His children.
2.) The new nature is “Life and Peace” (Rom. 8:6). The body is dead (i.e., reckoned as having died on account of sin, but the spirit (or new nature) is life on account of righteousness...Bibleunderstanding.com



The followers of the real Jesus get Holy spirit.
1John 3 explains who those are. There are FEW on this earth.
-- When the silence has broken--
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby cleve » Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:30 pm

WHAT IS YOUR CALLING?
Tom Ballinger

The word ”calling” is used to denote a Divine summons. Those who respond to this Divine summons (i.e. call) become members of a ”called-out group” which is denominated as being a ”church”; for church means a ”called-out company or assembly”. It is Scriptural correct to say that the word ”calling” is a word used by the Spirit of God to make known dispensational truth.

Rom. 11:29 “For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance”

1 Cor. 1:26 “For ye see your calling, brethren..”

1 Cor. 7:20 “abide in the same calling wherein he was called”.

Eph. 4:4 “…called in one hope of your calling”

Eph. 1:18 “…what is the hope of his calling”

Phil. 3:14 “…the prize of the high calling of God…”

2 Th. 1:11 “…count you worthy of this calling,.,”

2 Tim. 1:9 “Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling…”

Heb. 3:1 “…partakers of the heavenly calling…”

2 Pet. 1:10 “…give diligence to make your calling and election sure…”

These ten references can be ”rightly divided” into the three various callings. We will not so divide them but will set forth three headings which they would fall under:

(1) The calling of Israel,
(2) The calling of the Church of God (i.e. the called-out assembly
between Acts 2 and Acts 28:28)
(3) The calling of the Church of the Mystery.

To say that the three callings are two is an elementary mistake in first grade arithmetic. One plus one plus one equals three, not two. Most of Christendom makes this elementary mistake and are unable to distinguish between the calling of the Church of God and the Church of the Mystery.
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby cleve » Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:44 pm

Our exciting journey of discovery takes a new turn as we begin to focus on the hope set before us today by our God of
rich grace and great love. We, the previously cast off Nations of the world; we who are the heathen, the Gentiles of the
Scriptures, have received a glorious message of hope from our God through the Apostle Paul. For recent lessons in this series please visit;
http://www.bibleunderstanding.com/pastissues.htm
.
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby kjw47 » Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:30 pm

cleve wrote:Our exciting journey of discovery takes a new turn as we begin to focus on the hope set before us today by our God of
rich grace and great love. We, the previously cast off Nations of the world; we who are the heathen, the Gentiles of the
Scriptures, have received a glorious message of hope from our God through the Apostle Paul. For recent lessons in this series please visit;
http://www.bibleunderstanding.com/pastissues.htm
.




Yes it is a glorious hope, Sadly Jesus teaches Few find the entrance to the narrow gate--Fact 99% of all religions claiming to be Christian---ARENT. The facts of history and what Jesus teaches proves it so.
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby cleve » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:11 pm

1
WISE ...
or OTHERWISE ?
`The Holy Scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus'
(2
Timothy 3:15).
Salvation is by faith, but if it be necessary to be made `wise' unto salvation, faith must include understanding.
Faith cannot be mere credulity; can be no mere leap in the dark; cannot be antagonistic to the true exercise of reason.
The man who is made `wise' believes!
If, moreover, salvation is so connected with this God given wisdom, it suggests that there may be elements of
deadly folly in the mind of all those who believe not the glad news of a free salvation. We are sure that all thinking
men will agree that, with such vital issues at stake, it would indeed be the height of foolishness not to investigate the
grounds of this charge, and all can endorse out of their own experience the proverb: `There is a way which seemeth
right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death' (Proverbs 14:12).
Some men are `Wise'; some men we'll not be too pointed- are `Otherwise'! These latter folk are, without
apology, called `fools' in our English Bible, so let us at least see where we stand in this matter.
(1)
THERE IS A FOOL WHO SAYS IN HIS HEART, THERE IS NO GOD ' (Psalm 14:1).
What should we think of a man who had been taken through an aircraft works, where say a giant aeroplane was
being assembled, and had followed the process of its production, from the draughtsman's table to the `take off' at the
aerodrome; if after having seen with his own eyes all the marvels of mechanical skill and scientific adaptation, all
the evidences of design and fitness for purpose that such a machine exhibits; what, we say, should we think of a man
who maintained at the end of his tour that `There was no designer, no maker, no inventor - the thing just happened!'
Should we not put him down as a first class fool?
What shall we say, then, of the man who is surrounded with ten thousand times more evidence; evidence in sun,
moon and stars; evidence in fish, fowl and
flower; evidence in his own body, and in his own mind, of design,
purpose, and plan; of infinite wisdom, and almighty power, what shall we call that man who can still say with the
fool: `There is no God'? `Ye fools, when will ye be wise?' asked the Psalm
ist.
`He that planted the ear, shall He not hear? He that formed the eye, shall He not see?' (Psalm 94:8,9).
(2)
THERE IS THE FOOL WHO MAKES MOCK AT SIN'
(Proverbs 14:9).
This folly is deadly! It strikes at the heart of society, of family, of country, of honour, of liberty, of right, and of
truth. It makes light of the death-bed and the grave, for death came by sin. It mocks at sorrow and suffering, for
when the new creation comes wherein dwelleth righteousness, `sorrow and sighing will flee away'. Moreover, the
effects of sin are not exhausted by the experiences of this brief life, for sin casts its shadow beyond the grave, and
the conscience of man, equally with the Scriptures of truth, testify that `after death is the judgment'. To think lightly
of so serious a matter is to be a fool indeed.
2
Yet this is not all. He who mocks at sin, mocks at the sacrifice for sin. He joins the crowd who mocked the
dying Saviour as He gave His life a ransom for many. Surely he is a fool beyond parallel who can mock at either sin
or the Saviour. Yet, alas! the reader knows only too well that such mockers may be met in every walk of life.
(3)
THERE IS A THIRD KIND OF FOOL, THE FOOL WHOSE GOD IS HIS BANK BALANCE
.
This man's idea of life is an accumulation of `things', who says, in effect - like one of old- `I will pull down my barns, and build greater'; who says, `I will say to my soul ... Take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry'. To such, God has a word to say. He says: `Thou fool, this night thy soul
shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided?' (Luke 12:18-20).
When the apostle Paul visualised a life that ended in the grave, because the man had no hope of resurrection, he
said, in the language of hopeless despair: `Let us eat and drink; for tomorrow we die' (1Corinthians 15:32). Paul
could not use the words `be merry', for in a life without hope, such a word is a mockery: he, however, added what
the fool forgot -for tomorrow we die! What greater folly can be exhibited than is shown by men, who have stood by the open grave of loved ones, who
know that their own days are numbered, who know that whatever their possessions (great or small) may be, that they
will have to leave all behind when their hour arrives , and that they are journeying to an unknown destination,
without preparation and without hope, and who yet spend their mortal strength in accumulating things that perish,
while they turn aside from things that are immortal. As business men, are they not fools? Did ever wise men miss
such treasures for the sake of such tinsel?
Here, then, are three outstanding fools. The fool who denies his Maker; who mocks at sin, and who though he
gains the whole world loses his own soul.
(4)
THERE IS ONE FURTHER KIND OF FOOL; THE MAN WHO HAS BECOME A FOOL FOR CHRIST'S SAKE'
(1Corinthians 4:10).
Such a man was the apostle Paul. He had been a man of culture, a man of the highest moral character, yet, for
the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus his Lord, he had gladly flung aside prospect and position, lost caste,
and become a persecuted, hated, homeless outcast, `a fool for Christ's sake'! Yet this `fool' had exchanged the filthy
rags of his own righteousness, for the spotless robe of Christ's providing; he had exchanged a guilty conscience, for
the joy of sins forgiven; he had exchanged a position of condemnation, for one of justification, life, and peace; he
had exchanged bondage, for glorious liberty.
Will you allow these four Bible `fools' once more to pass before your mind? and will you give an honest answer
to the question:
Which of these four fools am I?
Charles H. Welch.
Affiliated with no religious group. Most people label me as a dispensationalist (sometimes preceded with ultra-) .
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby kjw47 » Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:23 pm

cleve wrote:1
WISE ...
or OTHERWISE ?
`The Holy Scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus'
(2
Timothy 3:15).
Salvation is by faith, but if it be necessary to be made `wise' unto salvation, faith must include understanding.
Faith cannot be mere credulity; can be no mere leap in the dark; cannot be antagonistic to the true exercise of reason.
The man who is made `wise' believes!
If, moreover, salvation is so connected with this God given wisdom, it suggests that there may be elements of
deadly folly in the mind of all those who believe not the glad news of a free salvation. We are sure that all thinking
men will agree that, with such vital issues at stake, it would indeed be the height of foolishness not to investigate the
grounds of this charge, and all can endorse out of their own experience the proverb: `There is a way which seemeth
right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death' (Proverbs 14:12).
Some men are `Wise'; some men we'll not be too pointed- are `Otherwise'! These latter folk are, without
apology, called `fools' in our English Bible, so let us at least see where we stand in this matter.
(1)
THERE IS A FOOL WHO SAYS IN HIS HEART, THERE IS NO GOD ' (Psalm 14:1).
What should we think of a man who had been taken through an aircraft works, where say a giant aeroplane was
being assembled, and had followed the process of its production, from the draughtsman's table to the `take off' at the
aerodrome; if after having seen with his own eyes all the marvels of mechanical skill and scientific adaptation, all
the evidences of design and fitness for purpose that such a machine exhibits; what, we say, should we think of a man
who maintained at the end of his tour that `There was no designer, no maker, no inventor - the thing just happened!'
Should we not put him down as a first class fool?
What shall we say, then, of the man who is surrounded with ten thousand times more evidence; evidence in sun,
moon and stars; evidence in fish, fowl and
flower; evidence in his own body, and in his own mind, of design,
purpose, and plan; of infinite wisdom, and almighty power, what shall we call that man who can still say with the
fool: `There is no God'? `Ye fools, when will ye be wise?' asked the Psalm
ist.
`He that planted the ear, shall He not hear? He that formed the eye, shall He not see?' (Psalm 94:8,9).
(2)
THERE IS THE FOOL WHO MAKES MOCK AT SIN'
(Proverbs 14:9).
This folly is deadly! It strikes at the heart of society, of family, of country, of honour, of liberty, of right, and of
truth. It makes light of the death-bed and the grave, for death came by sin. It mocks at sorrow and suffering, for
when the new creation comes wherein dwelleth righteousness, `sorrow and sighing will flee away'. Moreover, the
effects of sin are not exhausted by the experiences of this brief life, for sin casts its shadow beyond the grave, and
the conscience of man, equally with the Scriptures of truth, testify that `after death is the judgment'. To think lightly
of so serious a matter is to be a fool indeed.
2
Yet this is not all. He who mocks at sin, mocks at the sacrifice for sin. He joins the crowd who mocked the
dying Saviour as He gave His life a ransom for many. Surely he is a fool beyond parallel who can mock at either sin
or the Saviour. Yet, alas! the reader knows only too well that such mockers may be met in every walk of life.
(3)
THERE IS A THIRD KIND OF FOOL, THE FOOL WHOSE GOD IS HIS BANK BALANCE
.
This man's idea of life is an accumulation of `things', who says, in effect - like one of old- `I will pull down my barns, and build greater'; who says, `I will say to my soul ... Take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry'. To such, God has a word to say. He says: `Thou fool, this night thy soul
shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided?' (Luke 12:18-20).
When the apostle Paul visualised a life that ended in the grave, because the man had no hope of resurrection, he
said, in the language of hopeless despair: `Let us eat and drink; for tomorrow we die' (1Corinthians 15:32). Paul
could not use the words `be merry', for in a life without hope, such a word is a mockery: he, however, added what
the fool forgot -for tomorrow we die! What greater folly can be exhibited than is shown by men, who have stood by the open grave of loved ones, who
know that their own days are numbered, who know that whatever their possessions (great or small) may be, that they
will have to leave all behind when their hour arrives , and that they are journeying to an unknown destination,
without preparation and without hope, and who yet spend their mortal strength in accumulating things that perish,
while they turn aside from things that are immortal. As business men, are they not fools? Did ever wise men miss
such treasures for the sake of such tinsel?
Here, then, are three outstanding fools. The fool who denies his Maker; who mocks at sin, and who though he
gains the whole world loses his own soul.
(4)
THERE IS ONE FURTHER KIND OF FOOL; THE MAN WHO HAS BECOME A FOOL FOR CHRIST'S SAKE'
(1Corinthians 4:10).
Such a man was the apostle Paul. He had been a man of culture, a man of the highest moral character, yet, for
the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus his Lord, he had gladly flung aside prospect and position, lost caste,
and become a persecuted, hated, homeless outcast, `a fool for Christ's sake'! Yet this `fool' had exchanged the filthy
rags of his own righteousness, for the spotless robe of Christ's providing; he had exchanged a guilty conscience, for
the joy of sins forgiven; he had exchanged a position of condemnation, for one of justification, life, and peace; he
had exchanged bondage, for glorious liberty.
Will you allow these four Bible `fools' once more to pass before your mind? and will you give an honest answer
to the question:
Which of these four fools am I?
Charles H. Welch.



Every real follower of Jesus--carries on the work he began-Luke 10--Acts 20:20-- it does not stop until the end.
Repentence( the stopping of the doing of a sin) gets sin blotted out( Acts 3:19)--the teachers telling all that Jesus death covered over all their sin are not teaching truth. It just gives then an excuse to keep on sinning--just as the lie--once saved always saved, gets the same results
-- When the silence has broken--
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby cleve » Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:07 pm

kjw47 wrote:
Every real follower of Jesus--carries on the work he began-Luke 10--Acts 20:20-- it does not stop until the end.
Repentence( the stopping of the doing of a sin) gets sin blotted out( Acts 3:19)--the teachers telling all that Jesus death covered over all their sin are not teaching truth. It just gives then an excuse to keep on sinning--just as the lie--once saved always saved, gets the same results


Don't you think Jesus' main purpose in coming to earth was to teach us to learn to show his love to His Father and to all people? So, doesn't love begin and end with Jesus? Doesn't repentance cover sin as a result of the relationship that we have with Jesus our saviour? Truth becomes lost as a result of human dependence on step programs of men and/or religion.
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby kjw47 » Wed Jul 26, 2017 12:22 pm

cleve wrote:
kjw47 wrote:
Every real follower of Jesus--carries on the work he began-Luke 10--Acts 20:20-- it does not stop until the end.
Repentence( the stopping of the doing of a sin) gets sin blotted out( Acts 3:19)--the teachers telling all that Jesus death covered over all their sin are not teaching truth. It just gives then an excuse to keep on sinning--just as the lie--once saved always saved, gets the same results


Don't you think Jesus' main purpose in coming to earth was to teach us to learn to show his love to His Father and to all people? So, doesn't love begin and end with Jesus? Doesn't repentance cover sin as a result of the relationship that we have with Jesus our saviour? Truth becomes lost as a result of human dependence on step programs of men and/or religion.



Jesus taught us truth and the will of his Father. God always had a religion on earth starting in Genesis( Judaism)--But they were cut off-Matt 23:37-39) Jesus started one single new religion----not the one that came out of Rome years after nor its branches.
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby cleve » Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:57 am

kjw47 wrote:God always had a religion on earth starting in Genesis( Judaism)--But they were cut off-Matt 23:37-39)

Matt 23:38 refers to the end of the Jewish "world," Israel's house (the actual physical temple, as well as their way of worship) which was left desolate to them, along with Jesus saying that He would not see them again (v. 39). Their guilt of killing Jesus (a dead savior) and relief from this pain of guilt was dependent on their hope of a resurrected and living savior (Jesus). The hope of Israel (their recovery) lay in the expectation of Jesus dying for their sins. So, if Israel killed Jesus (Jesus knew that Israel would not see him again), how would Israel be able to see Jesus again unless he was resurrected? (Jesus knew - but the Jews didn't know - that He would be resurrected. Acknowledgement by the Jews of His resurrection would be indicated by their saying, "Blessed is He who cometh in the name of the Lord.")
But before Jesus died, he asked His Father to forgive Israel, for they knew not what they were doing. As a result, God's grace was extended to the point of judgment (a reference from Isaiah was made by Paul at this point) that took place at Acts 28:28.

Below are some charts covering our topic of conversation.
http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_balance_of_truth.htm
http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_change_in_callings.htm
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby kjw47 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:51 am

cleve wrote:
kjw47 wrote:God always had a religion on earth starting in Genesis( Judaism)--But they were cut off-Matt 23:37-39)

Matt 23:38 refers to the end of the Jewish "world," Israel's house (the actual physical temple, as well as their way of worship) which was left desolate to them, along with Jesus saying that He would not see them again (v. 39). Their guilt of killing Jesus (a dead savior) and relief from this pain of guilt was dependent on their hope of a resurrected and living savior (Jesus). The hope of Israel (their recovery) lay in the expectation of Jesus dying for their sins. So, if Israel killed Jesus (Jesus knew that Israel would not see him again), how would Israel be able to see Jesus again unless he was resurrected? (Jesus knew - but the Jews didn't know - that He would be resurrected. Acknowledgement by the Jews of His resurrection would be indicated by their saying, "Blessed is He who cometh in the name of the Lord.")
But before Jesus died, he asked His Father to forgive Israel, for they knew not what they were doing. As a result, God's grace was extended to the point of judgment (a reference from Isaiah was made by Paul at this point) that took place at Acts 28:28.

Below are some charts covering our topic of conversation.
http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_balance_of_truth.htm
http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_change_in_callings.htm



Judaism-NEVER- did verse 39---Spiritual Israel is now Gods chosen--They serve the God Israel served-a single being God named-YHVH(Jehovah) and accept Jesus as the one sent forth by God-the Messiah.
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby cleve » Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:26 am

kjw47 wrote:Judaism-NEVER- did verse 39

You mean Judaism never said, "Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord" in the flesh?

kjw47 wrote:-Spiritual Israel is now Gods chosen--

So, if you consider the history of the Jewish "olive tree root system" to be the basis of your present faith, have you not given up your present day rights as a Gentile believer? If you consider yourself to be a "historical" Gentile believer (still living in the days of Israel), does that mean that your present day rights as a Gentile believer have been set aside for a future time in God? According to Apostle Paul, at this time, does that mean that you have chosen to voluntarily limit yourself to focusing on "none other than" the law of Moses and the prophets? Individuals who are in the "Spirit of the Lord" have personal freedom in the Lord.

kjw47 wrote:They serve the God Israel served-a single being God named-YHVH(Jehovah) and accept Jesus as the one sent forth by God-the Messiah.

Israel is ..."a disobedient and obstinate people."
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby kjw47 » Fri Jul 28, 2017 4:30 pm

cleve wrote:
kjw47 wrote:Judaism-NEVER- did verse 39

You mean Judaism never said, "Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord" in the flesh?

kjw47 wrote:-Spiritual Israel is now Gods chosen--

So, if you consider the history of the Jewish "olive tree root system" to be the basis of your present faith, have you not given up your present day rights as a Gentile believer? If you consider yourself to be a "historical" Gentile believer (still living in the days of Israel), does that mean that your present day rights as a Gentile believer have been set aside for a future time in God? According to Apostle Paul, at this time, does that mean that you have chosen to voluntarily limit yourself to focusing on "none other than" the law of Moses and the prophets? Individuals who are in the "Spirit of the Lord" have personal freedom in the Lord.

kjw47 wrote:They serve the God Israel served-a single being God named-YHVH(Jehovah) and accept Jesus as the one sent forth by God-the Messiah.

Israel is ..."a disobedient and obstinate people."



Love is the New covenant--yet the Law is written on the heart of those with that kind of love. That love would never even consider having another God before their face, or stealing from their brothers, those wouldn't be coveting a brothers things, or mate. those would never commit adultery on ones own mate. etc,etc,etc. These live to do Gods will now-Matt 7:21, John 5:30-- Matt 16:24-- its how one can become one with YHVH(Jehovah) and his son. Living by every utterance from God daily.
The mislead hearts, don't even know they live in darkness. ( 2Cor 11:12-15)They are being told they live in the light. 2cor 4:4)--some refuse to believe in a God.
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Re: The work Jesus began

Postby cleve » Fri Jul 28, 2017 5:56 pm

kjw47 wrote:Love is the New covenant--yet the Law is written on the heart...

What is the Purpose of our Salvation?
(John 20:31 KJV) "But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name."

http://www.bereantruth.com/Purpose%20of%20Salvation.htm
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