Carbon in different forms...

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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Stacie Cook » Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:23 am

My kids are only in kindergarten, so we are not in the logic or rhetoric stage yet, but from what I understand the students in their essays and writings can offer arguments/positions for any point of view they choose including atheism, polytheism, etc. They gotta have mad logic and rhetortic skills and bring their game no matter what argument they are presenting.
Last edited by Stacie Cook on Sat Oct 31, 2015 8:29 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Stacie Cook » Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:24 am

Anyway- the point of the post is to say that carbon is amazing no matter what 'side' anyone is on.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby tirtlegrrl » Sat Oct 31, 2015 11:22 am

Some companies make bows and even instrument bodies from carbon fiber now. You can wash your viola under the tap!
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby somecallmeTim? » Sat Oct 31, 2015 4:22 pm

First definition of rhetoric on a google search...

rhet·o·ric ˈredərik/ noun
the art of effective or persuasive speaking or writing, especially the use of figures of speech and other compositional techniques.
synonyms: oratory, eloquence, command of language, way with words

Sounds pretty good to me.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Simplyme » Sat Oct 31, 2015 5:08 pm

That's funny. Here is what I got

language designed to have a persuasive or impressive effect on its audience, but often regarded as lacking in sincerity or meaningful content.

Fine with me
I find it rather amusing, when thought of as ignorant or stupid(though I can be on many subjects). Especially by those who believe in a deity up in heaven watching our every move, and rewarding or punishing us after we have expired.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Og3 » Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:22 am

Simplyme wrote:
Stacie Cook wrote:Sorry, perhaps I should have included that the school is a classical christian based school or latin based learning system. The younger grades start with memorization, around third grade they start learning latin, around middle school they learn tools of logic and then around high school they learn tools of rhetoric- to think and speak critically.

Tools of logic, think and speak critically? I highly doubt this considering your first post. Rhetoric is a tool used by many apologist, they confuse you with lots of big words. Word Soup.

Rhetoric - language designed to have a persuasive or impressive effect on its audience, but often regarded as lacking in sincerity or meaningful content.

Why would they teach this?

Because logic and reason are tools of God. You make the mistake of thinking that Christians must set their reason aside and reject logic in order to believe in God.

When I find a former Christian who has become an atheist, I seldom find that he has reasoned too much to be a Christian, and I often find that he has not reasoned enough to be a Christian.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Og3 » Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:25 am

Simplyme wrote:
Jesus Raves wrote:I'm skeptical also, Simply, but perhaps if what Stacie says is true, then perhaps, despite the religious bullshit, this school is still better than typical government-run schools.


Here in the States.....government run schools do not teach religion.

They actually do, but it is simply not a religion in any recognizable form. They teach an arbitrary ethos -- for example, that even a symbol representing a gun is evil beyond measure -- and they teach that one must not question the dictates of the educators. The deity is a combination of Gaea and Everyman.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Og3 » Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:31 am

Carbon has a third form, known as Buckminsterfullerene. 60 atoms of Carbon link in a soccer-ball shape. These molecules produce a transparent yellow solid known as Fullerite. This allotrope was discovered in 1985, and is the basis for more recent developments such as carbon nanotubes.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Simplyme » Sun Nov 08, 2015 5:07 pm

Because logic and reason are tools of God. You make the mistake of thinking that Christians must set their reason aside and reject logic in order to believe in God.


Logic and reason being the tools of god would explain the reason you can't seem to be able to use it, your not a god. To believe the fairy tales in the bible are true, logic would have to be thrown out the window. Who are you kidding?

When I find a former Christian who has become an atheist, I seldom find that he has reasoned too much to be a Christian, and I often find that he has not reasoned enough to be a Christian.


Have no idea what the above means.
I find it rather amusing, when thought of as ignorant or stupid(though I can be on many subjects). Especially by those who believe in a deity up in heaven watching our every move, and rewarding or punishing us after we have expired.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Og3 » Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:59 pm

Simplyme wrote:
Because logic and reason are tools of God. You make the mistake of thinking that Christians must set their reason aside and reject logic in order to believe in God.
Logic and reason being the tools of god would explain the reason you can't seem to be able to use it, your not a god. To believe the fairy tales in the bible are true, logic would have to be thrown out the window. Who are you kidding?
This being the CL, I will not respond in kind. :smt006

But there is no reason one cannot be a Christian and a logician. I am acquainted with an astrophysicist who became a Christian (Episcopalian) because his study of astronomy led him to believe that there must be a god. He is one of the most logical men I know, and he will stop you cold if you voice a misunderstanding of physics near him. And he became a Christian because of logic.
When I find a former Christian who has become an atheist, I seldom find that he has reasoned too much to be a Christian, and I often find that he has not reasoned enough to be a Christian.

Have no idea what the above means.

I mean that if you stopped trying to think up ad hominem attacks, and stopped parroting KTR long enough to think for yourself, you might make a fairly remarkable discovery.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby CL Moderator » Mon Nov 09, 2015 12:02 am

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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Simplyme » Mon Nov 09, 2015 3:18 pm

But there is no reason one cannot be a Christian and a logician. I am acquainted with an astrophysicist who became a Christian (Episcopalian) because his study of astronomy led him to believe that there must be a god. He is one of the most logical men I know, and he will stop you cold if you voice a misunderstanding of physics near him. And he became a Christian because of logic.


He became a xtian in spite of logic. Explain to me how he studied astronomy then "concluded" that a god exist? Was it something like, "because there are stars, therefore god must exist"? Sounds logical to me.
I find it rather amusing, when thought of as ignorant or stupid(though I can be on many subjects). Especially by those who believe in a deity up in heaven watching our every move, and rewarding or punishing us after we have expired.
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby spongebob » Mon Nov 09, 2015 3:25 pm

Og3 wrote:When I find a former Christian who has become an atheist, I seldom find that he has reasoned too much to be a Christian, and I often find that he has not reasoned enough to be a Christian.


I would challenge those assumptions. I know from experience meeting and conversing with other atheists that it's not a routine things for atheists to go around sharing their life story and how they deconverted from religion. It's a particularly difficult thing to communicate to a Christian because there are so many assumptions. So I question what you really know about this. And this is buttressed by the many Christians that have shown up here demonstrating how little they understand the thinking process that leads from Christianity to atheism. How many atheists do you really know well enough to speak confidently about their life?
Man is a credulous animal, and must believe something; in the absence of good grounds for belief, he will be satisfied with bad ones.
~Bertrand Russell

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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Razor » Mon Nov 09, 2015 3:28 pm

Og3 wrote:They actually do, but it is simply not a religion in any recognizable form. They teach an arbitrary ethos -- for example, that even a symbol representing a gun is evil beyond measure -- and they teach that one must not question the dictates of the educators. The deity is a combination of Gaea and Everyman.

An arbitrary ethos...must not questions the dictates...

What does that remind you of?!??
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Re: Carbon in different forms...

Postby Og3 » Mon Nov 09, 2015 7:29 pm

Simplyme wrote:
But there is no reason one cannot be a Christian and a logician. I am acquainted with an astrophysicist who became a Christian (Episcopalian) because his study of astronomy led him to believe that there must be a god. He is one of the most logical men I know, and he will stop you cold if you voice a misunderstanding of physics near him. And he became a Christian because of logic.

He became a xtian in spite of logic. Explain to me how he studied astronomy then "concluded" that a god exist? Was it something like, "because there are stars, therefore god must exist"? Sounds logical to me.

Actually -- and I'm paraphrasing my memory of his remarks, so forgive me if I misquote -- I believe he said that the sheer majesty of the cosmos caused him to believe that it could not have occurred without a God; this caused him to go on a spiritual and rational search for the logic of this God. This in turn led him to the Episcopalian faith. He was raised secular, in the greater Portland area.
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