Morality in American

[ChristianHeretic]

This Gallup Pole is pretty interesting. My favorite stat is that only 14% feel suicide is morally acceptable, unless of course you have a doctor help you, then 45% say that's ok. That's about 31% of people who feel you're in the clear morally as long as you get a doctors help?

[tirtlegrrl]

You honestly think the situations are the same, same people, same circumstance, only one is with a doctor present?

[StillSearching]

Yeah, I think those two scenarios can be dramatically different. Doctor-assisted suicide typically involves a person who is suffering from a debilitating and incurable medical condition. Most often, they are already facing death, often in a slow, undignified and painful manner. Most people sympathize with such a person and their desire to end their physical suffering. On the other hand, I think most people view, for example, a teenager who commits suicide because of emotional or psychological problems as "giving up" when they believe that with help the person could have overcome their problems and returned to a relatively normal life.

[humanguy]

It's interesting that 51% think that abortion is morally wrong while 58% think the death penalty is morally acceptable.

[Keep The Reason]

It's interesting that 51% think that abortion is morally wrong while 58% think the death penalty is morally acceptable.

Probably because they see unborn babies as guiltless of any crime and people sentenced to the DP as deserving of it.

[Dr Mundo]

64% believe porn to be morally wrong. That is interesting, I wonder what leads people to that conclusion and also why its so high up on the things searched for on the internet. You would think 90% of people would think its morally permissible with the porn statistics, or those 64% don't care about indulging in morally evil things once in a while.

[mitchellmckain]

I think that I would refuse to participate in such a poll, because I object to its premise that things can simply be labeled morally ok or morally wrong. Reading through it I found a great deal of it to be very offensive. I guess I would end up telling the people doing the poll that what THEY are doing is morally wrong.

I guess I should say which ones I found so offensive. Divorce tops the list putting me in a bad mood from the beginning. Divorse is very painful and regretable and demanding it to be labelled in this way is just WRONG! Doing this with birth control is of course absurd and wrong. The animal fur quetion is quite similar to many of these, where the poll is practically aksing people to push their own personal moral commitments on other people.

[Moonwood the Hare]

As someone trained in suicide intervention who teaches suicide awareness I would say asking whether suicide is morally wrong makes about as much sense as asking if farting is morally wrong.

[Keep The Reason]

I think that I would refuse to participate in such a poll, because I object to its premise that things can simply be labeled morally ok or morally wrong. Reading through it I found a great deal of it to be very offensive. I guess I would end up telling the people doing the poll that what THEY are doing is morally wrong.

I guess I should say which ones I found so offensive. Divorce tops the list putting me in a bad mood from the beginning. Divorse is very painful and regretable and demanding it to be labelled in this way is just WRONG! Doing this with birth control is of course absurd and wrong. The animal fur quetion is quite similar to many of these, where the poll is practically aksing people to push their own personal moral commitments on other people.

??? Someone asking a person their opinion is conflated with leveraging that person to push their own personal moral committments on other people? How? Other people's opinions are just that-- I am not obligated to take their answers as something thrust upon me.

[humanguy]

It's interesting that 51% think that abortion is morally wrong while 58% think the death penalty is morally acceptable.

Probably because they see unborn babies as guiltless of any crime and people sentenced to the DP as deserving of it.

Plenty of people who are guiltless of any crime have been executed.

[Keep The Reason]

It's interesting that 51% think that abortion is morally wrong while 58% think the death penalty is morally acceptable.

Probably because they see unborn babies as guiltless of any crime and people sentenced to the DP as deserving of it.

Plenty of people who are guiltless of any crime have been executed.

No argument from me. I'm just voicing what the arguments tend to be. I'm against the DP and I'm not for late term abortions unless something catastrophic is going n with the fetus. I have no problem with abortions for early fetuses though. As long as they are not aware or can feel pain, basically.

[Tim-the-Hermit]

As someone trained in suicide intervention who teaches suicide awareness I would say asking whether suicide is morally wrong makes about as much sense as asking if farting is morally wrong.

I agree, MW!

I sometimes worry about how the doctrine of hell could make life more difficult for people who feel suicidal.

People who are feeling so down or low that they are thinking about killing themselves cannot possibly be helped by what could be described as man-made(?) baggage about suffering forever after trying to get rid of their present suffering.

Another point: why do people not intervene more strongly and earlier on some of the things which make people feel this way? eg Harsh welfare rules and joblessness.

Did I explain that all right?

[mitchellmckain]

As someone trained in suicide intervention who teaches suicide awareness I would say asking whether suicide is morally wrong makes about as much sense as asking if farting is morally wrong.

I did not give suicide as one that offended me because that one is a bit more complicated. I agree that it is not extremely helpful to label it as morally wrong, but it isn't like divorse or abortion where we would ultimately leave this up to people to do as they choose. In other words, suicide really isn't considered to be an acceptable option. Its not that we cannot think of situations where it would make sense, so I think the main reason for this is that this isn't a case where we can simply say that it is none of our business or that we do not care. Its not so helpful to label it as morally wrong because the dynamics are very different. This is something for which we are far more concerned about the cause than the effect.

Compare it to murder for example where the cause might be anger. In that case our concern is not the anger which we not only accept as natural but which we understand can be bad to deny or repress. In that case it is how the anger is expressed which is unacceptable. But in the case of suicide our concern is quite different. We would NOT say its ok to feel that way as long as we don't act on it, and that is why it isn't helpful to label it as morally wrong. We are far more concerned with addressing the reasons why a person would want to end their life, because all too often it points to circumstances which need to be addressed and changed -- whether it is the illness of depression or it is people or situations that are making the persons life unbearable.

That of course leads us to the special case where there IS nothing that anyone can do, such as an incurable illness that offers only great pain. In that case many feel that ending ones life is an acceptable option. Unfortunately there are practical difficulties which make this a legal nightmare. Once the person is dead, how can we know that is what they wanted. This could be subject to abuse which is quite terrible. So the controversy on this issue rages on.

What is my opinion on this?

I find the arguments on both sides compelling and so I can only say that it is difficult. This may be one of the cases, and I do think there are others, where the law and government cannot help and where we may have to simply do what we think is right even if the law must condemn and punish it.

[ChristianHeretic]

It's interesting that 51% think that abortion is morally wrong while 58% think the death penalty is morally acceptable.

Probably because they see unborn babies as guiltless of any crime and people sentenced to the DP as deserving of it.

Plenty of people who are guiltless of any crime have been executed.

Yes, it is possible that potentially 1 to 5 of these 43 people in 2011 were "guiltless." Although I don't know about "plenty" and I would say all of the 43 were most "likely" guilty given the scrutiny applied. But in fact, it is also possible that the same percentage, let's just lowball and say 10% of these over 1m unborn babies were actually living individuals, these 100,000 babies in one year were absolutely "guiltless." To compare the two is silly...

[Tim-the-Hermit]

and I would say all of the 43 were most "likely" guilty given the scrutiny applied.

The amount of scrutiny applied only tells you about the amount of scrutiny applied, it doesn't tell us any more than that, does it?

I'm against the Death Penalty by principle of - 'two wrongs don't make a right.'

Ironically, although I'm a soft atheist, by happy co-incidence:

"Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also."