Sole Fide, By Faith Alone

[mitchellmckain]

i wrote a response and somehow it didn't work and i will only rewrite it if you seemed to respond with your same answer from previous post. So quickly:

1. so the product of a destroyed essence of life is death. Correct? and what is essence of life from the Bible?

Sin destroys free will and thus the product of sin is death. But does this mean that those who commit a sin drop dead on the spot? No. Because death of the body is not the only kind of death spoken of in the Bible. As in Luke 9:60, people can be walking around and doing things but still be dead inside where it really counts.

The phrase "essence of life" is not in the Bible, nor is even the word "essence" used in the Bible. But neither are the words "computer" or "galaxy" and yet it is quite obvious that these exist, and you will not find anything about them in the Bible, but that does not mean that you cannot find things about them which are true.

2. You still haven't proven you position that sin destroys free will from the bible.

Granted. There are a very great number of things which I believe which cannot be proven. I believe that there is an irreducibly subjective aspect to reality. But I cannot prove it. I believe that the physical is not all that is real. But I cannot prove it, even assuming that the previous is correct. I believe that an spiritual being to whom we refer to as God created the universe and all living things. But I cannot prove it, even assuming that the previous is correct. I believe that the Bible is the word of God. But I cannot prove it, even assuming that the previous is correct. I believe that the doctrine of the Trinity is correct. But I cannot prove it, even assuming that previous is correct. And yes I believe that the destruction of free will is what sin is all about. But I cannot prove it, even assuming that previous is correct.

Does all this seem strange to you? I would not have thought it so strange to a Christian. BUT even if you were a scientist, I would reply that I believe that mathematics is consistent. But I cannot prove it -- not only that but Godel proved that it is impossible to prove such a thing.

[mikedsjr]

1. I rest my case. You just fabricate your thoughts and throw on philosophy to muddy the water.

2. I rest my case. it isn't in the bible.

[mitchellmckain]

1. I rest my case. You just fabricate your thoughts and throw on philosophy to muddy the water.

2. I rest my case. it isn't in the bible.

Yes, a case that rests on the delusion that all truth is found in the Bible. You are welcome to your delusion but I want no part of it.

[mikedsjr]

I have never said ALL TRUTH is ONLY found in the bible. What does come from the bible is ALL NECCESSARY SPIRITUAL TRUTH for us to know. I rested my case because u have demonstrated u couldn't demonstrate ur spiritual belief above.

[mitchellmckain]

I have never said ALL TRUTH is ONLY found in the bible. What does come from the bible is ALL NECCESSARY SPIRITUAL TRUTH for us to know. I rested my case because u have demonstrated u couldn't demonstrate ur spiritual belief above.

Ah what is necessary... yes I expected that. The problem is that this too is a delusion. To stick to what is necessary only is the same legalistic attitude as the servant which the master gave one talent in Matt 25:14-30. There is no such thing as enough. There is no such thing as just that which is necessary. You cannot earn your way into heaven. There is no fullilling your end of the bargain, because their IS NO BARGAIN. It is all about attitude. Either you are interested in the truth or you are not. But if you are only going to go so far and no farther because you don't want to do any more than the minimum then what did Jesus say in the parable of the talents? "For the one who has will be given more, and he will have more than enough. But the one who does not have, even what he has will be taken from him. And throw that worthless slave into the outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

This shows that the Bible is not an excuse for playing it safe. Don't forget what Jesus said in the gospel of John 5:39, "you search the scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they which bear witness to me; yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life." And do not deceive yourself that you have Jesus already. No one has Jesus. God does not fit in anyone's pocket and so what you have in your pocket isn't God at all.

Look you don't have to be interested in what I say, but your demand of proofs is is a total hypocrisy for you cannot prove the doctrine of the Trinity or indeed a tenth of what you believe any more than I can. So get off your imaginary high horse, you have absolutely no call to look down on anyone for any reason. I have no problem with your decision to stick to what is in the Bible as you see it and to go no farther. I make exactly the same decision and so I am not interested in what is in the Koran or the Bagavagita.

If you do not see any truth in what I say by all means disregard it. I pretend to no authority. But making your understanding of the Bible the measure of all things is something quite different. You and your understanding are not the measure. God is the only one who measures. The only judgement you can make with any validity is what is of value to you, but your talk of a making a case is just foolishness. The only thing you prove to me is your own limitations. Yes I have my limitations too, of course we all do. We are finite beings. It is the nature of our existence. But if you imagine that your limitations define the extent of God and reality as a whole, then that is a rather sad way to be.

[mikedsjr]

I get that you believe everything you just said. I just wanted to reply back quickly to let you know I will respond, but it may take me a bit of time to reply back. Too many things going on in life but I do find it important to reply back to this post you wrote in great detail.